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Health and medicine
Course: Health and medicine > Unit 2
Lesson 3: Heart depolarization- Membrane potentials - part 1
- Membrane potentials - part 2
- Permeability and membrane potentials
- Action potentials in pacemaker cells
- Action potentials in cardiac myocytes
- Resetting cardiac concentration gradients
- Electrical system of the heart
- Depolarization waves flowing through the heart
- A race to keep pace!
- Thinking about heartbeats
- New perspective on the heart
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A race to keep pace!
Find out how the various pacemaker cells in the heart actually race against the clock to try to keep pace for the heart, and how the heart has not one but two back up systems! Rishi is a pediatric infectious disease physician and works at Khan Academy. Created by Rishi Desai.
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- I'm assuming that the heart rate and cycle length you have written atare at rest. What happens when you exercise? I'm guessing that the pacemaker cells in the SA node aren't entirely "automatic" (in the sense that they depolarize randomly/at a certain rhythm) but rather take in some sort of input from the nervous system that indicate how quickly they should fire? How does the heart beat faster? 5:16(3 votes)
- They are semi-automatic. That is they can work on their own if needed but CNS does help time after time to regulate their rhythm in response to metabolic needs.(3 votes)
- if my heart rate is 50 because I exercise, which node will be activated first? SA or AV?(2 votes)
- Physiological bradycardia, such as that due to an exercised heart, does not arise from an abnormal pathway. Your impulses still arise from the SA node.(3 votes)
- Does it ever happen that the Purkinje fibres are driving the heartbeat as a "Plan D"?(2 votes)
- Purkinje fibers can indeed take over as a plan "D" because they also have that "unstable" action potential phase 4 depolarization that gives cells automaticity. rj is right as this type of worst-case scenario pacemaker is very unstable and usually leads to very dangerous arrhythmias in the heart.(2 votes)
- At, how do the cells of the pacemaker nodes have different permeabilities to Na+? Is it simply different numbers of slow leak Na+ channels in the cell walls or & if so, is this genetically determined? 2:20(2 votes)
- This is the basic structure of the heart, perfected by more than a few years of evolution : )(1 vote)
- I measured my heartbeat duration to be approximately 1,5 seconds, I have a puls(HR ?) about 40. Does that mean that SA node gave up and my rythm is AV-rythm?(1 vote)
- No :)
The heart rate is usually controlled by the sinus node. But even the sinus node listen to command from above.
The vagus nerve goes from our brain to the heart and tells it to relax when the body need less blood than the sinus rhythm of 60 bpm.
The opposite happens when need lots of blood. adrenalin gets the sinus node to go really fast.(1 vote)
- Let's say your SA node fails to fire, and your AV node also fails to fire. Now 1 second has passed, and at 1.32 seconds, your SA node fires. The wave is travelling from the SA node to the AV node (1.32 sec to 2.12 sec) and since 2 seconds have passed, will your BoH fire? And if it does, what will happen when the 2 waves meet up?(1 vote)
- Yes this is possible. The retrograde wave from the BoH and the wave originating from the sinus node will "collide" and stop. If the wave originating from the BoH conducts successfully to the ventricles than you will see a QRS on ECG (ventricular beat). Or the BoH wave might not conduct to the ventricle and there will be just a p-wave without a QRS - this is called concealed conduction.(1 vote)
- atWhy exactly is this delay already built into the body? 10:53(1 vote)
- To prevent the forces of the atria and ventricles contracting from opposing each other, or in muscle terms, being antagonistic to one another. This would cause the atria and ventricles to beat against each other. This wouldn't be good, as you probably want at least some of your blood going out to systemic! Ha ha, ok, jokes aside, on a neurological note, when antagonistic muscles, say of the leg, contract simultaneously, they produce what's called clonus. Here's a short video to illustrate the point: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UX75k8s5QUE(1 vote)
- If the SA and AV nodes both fail, does that mean that the atria don't contract at all? Or can it conduction travel backwards to depolarize the cells above the BOH?(1 vote)
- From MJL:
The retrograde wave from the BoH and the wave originating from the sinus node will "collide" and stop. If the wave originating from the BoH conducts successfully to the ventricles than you will see a QRS on ECG (ventricular beat). Or the BoH wave might not conduct to the ventricle and there will be just a p-wave without a QRS - this is called concealed conduction.
Copied and pasted just so you could get your question answered!(1 vote)
- I have read that the AV node does not contain any pacemaker cells, rather, the AV node is a tangled network of fibers or pathways with the purpose to slow the impulse down(delay) on its way to the ventricles. This delay allows maximal filling of the ventricle with blood. There are pacemaker cells around the AV node and the AV junction and this is the area that fires should the sinus node fail to fire--not the AV node itself. Is my information incorrect?(1 vote)
- Yes, the AV node is NOT an intrinsic pacemaker. The bundle of His (aka AV bundle) is however, and it is the structure that fires at ~40-60bpm. Lastly, it's the purkinje fibers that maintain the fail-safe automaticity ("plan C") with an intrinsic rate of ~20-40bpm.(1 vote)
- How can you tell what degree ( 1-2-3) right bundle branch block you have(1 vote)
- To the best of my knowledge, RBBB is more of a present or absent thing and isnt really subdivided into degrees. However, what you might be referring to is 1st, 2nd, and 3rd degree AV nodal block. For that here is how you would tell using an ECG
1.) First Degree AV nodal Block: you will see a lengthening of the PR interval, but not any missed QRS Complexes. http://www.learntheheart.com/ecg-review/ecg-topic-reviews-and-criteria/first-degree-av-block-review/
2.) Second Degree AV Block: this is when you see a lengthening of the PR interval and a missed QRS complex. This is further subdivided based on wether the PR interval progressively gets longer each beat before the dropped QRS (Type 1) or if it is just lengthened in general (Type 2) http://www.learntheheart.com/ecg-review/ecg-topic-reviews-and-criteria/second-degree-av-block-type-i-wenkebach-review/
3.) Third Degree (complete) AV Block. This is where the Atria and Ventricles are disconnected from one another. You will see the P waves going along at rapid speeds (60-100 BPM) and then the QRS complexes going along at slower speeds (30-40 BPM). The beating of the of the P waves and the QRS complexes will remain rhythmic to themselves, but they will not be associated with each other. http://www.learntheheart.com/ecg-review/ecg-topic-reviews-and-criteria/third-degree-av-block-review/(1 vote)
Video transcript
So we've talked
about pacemaker cells and I thought it would be
kind of neat to draw out again exactly what these pacemaker
cells do and compare them to one another. So we know we have different
types of pacemaker cells. And I'm going to use our
millivolt scale just as we usually do to kind
of compare them. So the first type
is our SA node. So let me put that up here. SA node. And those cells
start out negative and then they kind of
slowly creep up positive. And try to remember
why that happens. The main reason for
that is that you have the increasing
sodium permeability. So at this point, more sodium is
kind of rushing into the cell, sodium is getting in. And if it's getting
in quickly, let's say it's like just gushing in, then
that line would be very, very steep, you know? Something like this. But if it was kind of
getting in very slowly, it would be a little
bit more shallow. So I've drawn it kind of the
way that it usually is drawn. Kind of somewhere in between. And when that sodium
permeability hits or when that cell hits
a certain threshold, let's say somewhere in there. Then it's going to fire an
action potential, right? So this is our
threshold for firing. And that just means that the
channels for calcium open up and so they open up and
make the cell go positive. And then eventually, the
potassium channels take over and it becomes negative again. And this part
right here then, we think of as the
action potential. So this is what it looks
like for the SA node. But let me now do it
again for the AV node. So if there's an AV node,
it's going to kind of get up to that threshold a
little bit more slowly, but once it gets
there, it's going to look basically the
same as the SA node. Really no different. And it's going to
come down again. So this might be the AV node. And finally, we have,
let's say, a cell that takes even longer
to get to threshold. This would be like
the bundle of His and, again, it looks
basically the same once it does get there though. So these action
potentials don't really look that different from one
another, but the amount of time it takes to get to
threshold changes because the bundle of His
cells, for example, they are going to be the least
permeable to sodium. An AV node would be
somewhere in between and the SA node are most
permeable to sodium. So that's why those
lines are slightly less steep as you go along. So this is how it looks
and the key difference here is that you're basically
extending this heartbeat out, right? This is one heartbeat and
this would be like the SA node heartbeat, but if your AV node
was controlling your heartbeat, it might take a little bit
longer, something like that. And if your bundle of His was
taking control of your heart, the heartbeat would be really
long, something like that. So it would take
longer and longer for the heartbeat
in terms of time. Depending on which part of the
electrical connection system is in charge. So let's actually think
about that a little bit more carefully. So let's say we have
our SA node and you're talking about heartbeats. Let's actually write out,
let's say, heart rate, heart rate is HR. And this is going to
be in beats per minute. And then let's say I
flipped it around and wanted to know how long one beat takes. So one beat. And that will probably
have to be done in seconds. So how would that
be for the SA node? Well, we know that the
SA node, and this is just a number out of books, you
can find them saying something like 60 to 90 beats per minute. And if we took the upper
range, let's say you took 90, and try to figure out how
long one beat would take, well, you'd say, OK. You have one minute gives you
90 beats, I'll put B for beats. And then you have one, let's say
minute, is 60 seconds, right? And so the minutes cancel. And now you're left with, the
zeros cancel, 2/3 of a second. Right? So 2/3 of a second per beat. And actually, I might even
like to I'm going to erase 2/3 and just rewrite that as 0.66. OK? It's 0.66. Something like that So that's how long it
takes for the SA node to fire off one beat. And, in fact, just to really
hammer home the point, that's this distance,
right here, right? That's 0.66 seconds. So now for the AV node, we
could do the exact same thing. We could say, well, the
AV node, we know usually is somewhere between
40 to 60 beats. And I'm going to
use that number. And this one's
really easy, right? Because if it's
60 beats a minute, that means that one
beat is 1 second. So that was actually
a really quick one. So that's 1 second. And finally for
the bundle of His, I'm going to write
that as BoH again. Bundle of His is going to
be somewhere between let's say 20 to 30 beats per minute. And if we use the
number 30, that means that you get a
beat every 2 seconds. So every 2 seconds,
this will go off. And I know that my picture now,
since you know those numbers, it's not going to
look as impressive. Because I should have drawn
the bundle of His even more stretched out than
it is, but just assume that that's two
seconds on that graph. So if that's the case,
now let's kind of jump back to how we usually
think about our heart. And the fact that you've
got four chambers, right? And the conduction
system is actually going to go through all of that. And starts here in the SA
node, goes down to the AV node, and then you've got the bundle
of His somewhere down there. And you've got
connections down there. And you might be thinking,
well, wait a second, you haven't drawn
in all of the rest of the electrical conduction
system, and that's true, but for right now, let's just
focus on these three parts. Right? So you've got AV here, and
you've got the bundle of His over here, BoH. So you've got these three parts. And they're kind of spaced out. Right? Like this is 2 centimeters
apart, let's say. I'm just kind of guesstimating. This might be even closer,
let's say one centimeter. So these are kind
of anatomically how they're laid out. In terms of how far apart
they are from each other. So the question might
come up, how exactly do you explain the
fact that it's always the SA node that fires off? Right? It's never your AV node
or your bundle of His. We always say, well, he's
in sinus rhythm, right? And what does that mean? Well, if someone says
someone is in sinus rhythm, all they're saying
is that the SA node is what's controlling
their rhythm. So sinus rhythm, you might
hear that actually a lot on TV shows, I've noticed, they like
to throw that term around. And it just means that you're in
a rhythm controlled by your SA node. So how does that work exactly? Because if it's firing every
0.66 seconds, that's fine, but how come these two other
pacemaker cells aren't ever firing? Well, it gets back to basically
trying to beat them out. So if you can get a
signal from your SA node, this is, let's say, your
SA node from that drawing above, if you can get
it to your AV node faster, if you can get that
signal there faster, than it would fire, then
you've beat it out. So basically, if you can get
that signal from the SA node over to the AV node,
if this happens in less than one
second, then the AV node is not going to get a chance
to fire before you're already firing for it. So this is the race, right? The SA node is basically
trying to get a signal over there quickly. And these distances
that it has to cover, we said about 2 centimeters
and about 1 centimeter. So what is the math? How does that work out? So you can actually
look up these numbers and it turns out that
if you check it out, these conduction velocities
are really, really fast, right? So it's about 0.5 meters
per second up here. And it's gets even faster
as you get along further. So it's about 2 meters
per second here. So these are the
velocities of the signal, how fast the electrical
conduction system is actually sending along that signal. And those are the distances. So if you think about it,
if you just multiply them, you should be able
to get a time. How long it will take a
signal to get from the SA to the AV node. So we know that the SA node
fires every 0.66 seconds, right? That much we have
figured out already. So the question is can it
get a signal to the AV node before the AV node
fires by itself? Can it get a signal down
there in less than 1 second? You're trying to
beat out this time. And can it get a signal
to the bundle of His in less than 2 seconds? You're trying to beat
out that time as well. So let's figure out. So this math works out to,
let's see, you've got 0.5 meters and you're going to
want to end with a time. So I'm going to put
1 second up here. And you have, let's say, 1
meter is 100 centimeters. So the meters cancel. And you've got 2
centimeters to cover. So the centimeters cancel. So you've got 2 divided by 50. And that's seconds. So it's 0.66 seconds,
plus 1/25 That's 1/25. Let me make a little
bit more space on here. Just so it doesn't
feel as crowded. There we go. So 1/25 of a second is
the same as 0.04 seconds. And that is 0.7 seconds. So, so far the signal has
gotten here in 0.7 seconds. I'm just going to
write that in yellow because this is
the SA node signal. 0.7 seconds. Wow, that's really fast, right? Really fast. Let's see how long it takes
to get to the bundle of His. To get to the bundle of His,
I'll do that math over here. You have to now
add up 0.7 seconds because that's how long it
took to get to that AV node. And then you have to add 0.1
seconds and what is that for? This, my friends, is the delay. This is the delay
of the AV node. Remember, the AV node
creates this delay so that the ventricles
contract just a little bit after the atriums do. So this delay is actually
built into the system. The delay is about
1/10 of a second. And then you have to figure out
how long it takes to travel. So how long does it take to
travel that last little bit. Well, it's going to be going
1 second, it covers 2 meters, and we know that 1 meter
has 100 centimeters. And we know that we're
trying to cover 1 centimeter. So centimeters
cancel, meters cancel. And you're left
with 1/200 seconds. So that's how long it
actually takes to travel. Travel time, you
can think of it as. So that would be 0.005 seconds. So in total, it's now
taking us 0.805 seconds. So this is how long it takes
to get to the bundle of His. So now, let me write that up
here, 0.805 seconds, now we're really happy because we were
able to beat out both the AV node-- and I guess from the
perspective of the SA node, if SA node cells got
happy, that's what they would look like. So it basically gets there
really, really quickly is the point. So 0.7 seconds
and 0.805 seconds. So that explains at least
why you never really see the AV node or the bundle
of His cells firing, right? Now going back up here,
imagine for a second that you actually had a problem. Let's say you actually
had some sort of disease or some sort of
issue with your cells and let's say these
SA node cells gave up. Well, if they gave
up, then no signal would be coming into the
AV node and the AV node becomes your plan B. This
is your plan B. The SA node, of course, that's
your plan A. That's what you're usually doing. But it's nice because
you have this plan B and if one second goes
by without a signal, then the AV node kicks in
and that'll start firing. And you'll have a new heart rate
something closer to 40 to 60, but at least your
heart is beating. Now let's say catastrophe
strikes and your AV node is down too. Well, your bundle of
His is your plan C. And so now if 2 seconds go
by and your bundle of His have not gotten a signal,
then they start firing and your heart rate will be
somewhere between 20 and 30. So these are the
backup mechanisms your heart has to make
sure it always beats. And this is one
of the neat things that your heart has figured
out, to create not just a plan A, but also a
plan B, and a plan C.